The Way: Easter Eggs and Secrets Guide

A moderated forum to discuss topics surrounding the Way series

Moderators: Porter, EmperorJeramyu, Telephalsion

Postby EmperorJeramyu » Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:38 am

Sarcasm wrote:As I have stated many times, I refuse to accept the fact that the other endings are real

Oh come on. The Reaches ending is a completely abstract non-sequitur ending found by achieving completely abstract non-sequitur tasks that exist completely outside the flow of the story. If you refuse to accept the other endings (or at least the normal one) as real, then that's your shortcoming. None of the endings provided any closure, IMO.

Sarcasm wrote:You can deny The Way being a tragedy, but you cannot deny the fact that the two last episodes used most of the prominent elements of one. (And for me, at least, earlier episodes were more like some background for the last two)

Tragic elements, sure. Slade, Sacrifa, Lyrra. But I still thought the overlaying feel of episodes 1, 2, and 3 was the spirit of adventure, with a slightly focused goal. Episode 4 really sent the plot into a dedicated line, but I won't maintain that it was necessarily and entirely tragic.

Sarcasm wrote:...the later theme of The Way has undeniably pointed to a tragic direction, and the sudden dawning so prominent in tragedy is often expressed by Plato's cave analogy, that corresponds to "Truth hides nothing".

Tragic direction? Possibly. But that doesn't mean the true ending is everybody spontaneously dying after some abstract cutscenes. That's like ending Romeo and Juliet by having them both suddenly die of heart attacks in the tomb. If you absolutely must have one, the real tragedy (IMO) is Traziun's sacrifice in the normal ending. I am of the opinion that "truth" is its own independent outcome outside of tragic or happy. Happy and tragic are in the eye of the beholder, but truth is inerrant, unless you're pigheaded and deny it vehemently against logic (much in the vein of the Lexus ending, which I will admit I am not particularly fond of).
"Unfortunately, the dragon only speaks in Napalm, a curious ancient language that you don't really need to speak to understand."
User avatar
EmperorJeramyu
Blana Sera
 
Posts: 2271
Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:38 pm

Postby Sarcasm » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:05 pm

Many tragedies do not seem like they are ones until the very last moment, anyway, I agree that The Way is far from being a full fledged tragedy, but it contains many elements of what creates such a story, and I believe that if The Way is not a tragedy in the full meaning of the word, its some sort of an hybrid.

and my refusal to accept the other endings was because they left me nearly depressed and with an empty heart, there was no beauty in them, only pure logic and some closure, The Reaches ending was the exact opposite, it contained very little that we can understand and revealed us next to nothing, but, it has also contained what I believe is lun's greatest work, the final monologe in the way:

I don't know what I was seeking.
I don't know what I had hoped to find.

When you waste away to a point where there's nothing left,
that's when you find Truth.
When the clouds of desire are swept away by the cleansing wind of suffering,
that's when you see clearest.

But can you let go of all that you cherish?
For everything will be destroyed.
Both joy and despair.
And even if you do this,
will it save you?

No one knows.
You will never find yourself.
You can only create that which is to be yours.
Why are you afraid?
Because my hands are unsteady, and my mind is ill.
I can't change,
I don't know how.

My search for that which made me happy
was in vain.
Just as well.
A moment of happiness isn't meaning.
It feels shallow to me.
But I don't know any other way.


While story-wise the regular ending offered us the most closure, the Reaches ending offered us an ending that is worthy of The Way, one that captures it's essence.
1,000,000,672+1D4 Bludgeoning to the face, bitch!
User avatar
Sarcasm
S1 Corlyn
 
Posts: 1091
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 5:15 pm

Postby MusashiEX » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:08 pm

I agree with Sarcasm here. I was almost crying after getting the Pits ending.
Impossible wrote:Isn't YOUR MOTHER a comment?
User avatar
MusashiEX
S5 Hilyn
 
Posts: 940
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2006 7:24 pm
Location: Toronto, Canada

Postby EmperorJeramyu » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:52 pm

Sarcasm wrote:one that captures it's essence.

Define the "essence" of The Way.
"Unfortunately, the dragon only speaks in Napalm, a curious ancient language that you don't really need to speak to understand."
User avatar
EmperorJeramyu
Blana Sera
 
Posts: 2271
Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:38 pm

Postby Rangi42 » Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:36 pm

MusashiEX wrote:Didn't Lun say that he only put Begining there because of people complaining? I remember it used to be End.

EDIT: Checked it, and it used to be Fin.


That may be, but Lun nevertheless put "The Beginning" in, making it a part of the game. Sherlock Holmes came back to life because of fans who demanded further stories, but that doesn't make his return a fake.

EmperorJeramyu wrote:If you absolutely must have one, the real tragedy (IMO) is Traziun's sacrifice in the normal ending.


...a death which isn't even tragic in the traditional sense; Traziun died because of the Phantom Slasher's flaws, not his own. Yes, the possibility of a parallel with Jesus is there (if you ignore that his death is, as far as we know, permanent), as with so many epics -- now that that's out of the way, to continue the debate of whether The Way is a tragedy, and which endings are real or not. I think that whatever ending the "No Puzzles" option guides you to (i.e., the one with Traziun destroying the sword and himself, and Rhue restarting his life) is the "true" ending, but that's just my opinion.

Concerning "Scatman's Autobiography": does anyone know what type of music Phlounder played? And then there's "PBW: The Rise and Fall" and the PBW Boys House...
I've used this name on boards for a while before I learned about the artist and Crestfallen Studios site designer Rangi.
Rhue: People aren't perfect!
Phantom: People are selfish.
Rhue: They can change...
Phantom: You know they can't.
Rhue: Some try!
Phantom: All fail.
Rhue: ... ...I don't care. I just want someone who won't stop trying. And I won't stop either...
User avatar
Rangi42
Plyn
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:59 pm

Postby Sarcasm » Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:27 pm

EmperorJeramyu wrote:
Sarcasm wrote:one that captures it's essence.

Define the "essence" of The Way.

Lun has said it himself in his notes in the game: "Truth and the journey to reach it", the same essence as some of the most famous tragedies such as Oedipus.

I may be wrong, but Truth Hides Nothing seems to be a slightly twisted version of the infamous Dawning in the end of a tragedy that takes place after the first part of the play (I nickname it "Know thyself" )

Neverless, this is a theory like any other, but you have to admit it is a soild one.
1,000,000,672+1D4 Bludgeoning to the face, bitch!
User avatar
Sarcasm
S1 Corlyn
 
Posts: 1091
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 5:15 pm

Postby EmperorJeramyu » Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:54 pm

Sarcasm wrote:Lun has said it himself in his notes in the game: "Truth and the journey to reach it", the same essence as some of the most famous tragedies such as Oedipus.

That certainly is an allusion of sort (Whether Lun intended it or not), but I don't think it necessarily means tragedy captures the essence of The Way. Upon reading and reflecting on the monologue in the reaches, it does outline a bold definition of truth, but largely ignores the logistics of the plot. So I guess the "Truth" in Truth Hides Nothing could be referring to either one of two truths (the truth about Rhue and The Way, or the "truth" as a concept), but the reaches ending still seemed like an addendum to the rest of the story that simply presented some philosophy as opposed being any "real ending". In that respect, the reaches ending isn't even really an "ending" at all, but rather what I said before: an abstract non-sequitur that the plot doesn't come out of. I believe that from the moment Rhue gets knocked down into the endless abyss, nothing is physical, unless the bottom of the reaches is some sort of hellish dreamscape, which could certainly be possible, but it's still a dreamscape. (Actually, I like that theory).

Sarcasm wrote:I may be wrong, but Truth Hides Nothing seems to be a slightly twisted version of the infamous Dawning in the end of a tragedy that takes place after the first part of the play (I nickname it "Know thyself")

Like I said, I think tragedy is independent of truth (and vice versa), but once again, this is all opinion.
"Unfortunately, the dragon only speaks in Napalm, a curious ancient language that you don't really need to speak to understand."
User avatar
EmperorJeramyu
Blana Sera
 
Posts: 2271
Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:38 pm

Postby Sarcasm » Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:33 pm

Well, it seems we have finally reached an agreement (In a civilized way no less, suprisingly enough).

And actually in the second part of my post, the one you quoted, I was refering to an analogy between the greatest tragedy (Oedipus) and The Way, In both cases, fully learning eveything on yourself shall not save you but instead destroy you given the fact this is not knowledge mere mortals were ment to know.

Look to the light of the sun, and you shall get insight.
Look directly at the sun, and you shall get madness.
1,000,000,672+1D4 Bludgeoning to the face, bitch!
User avatar
Sarcasm
S1 Corlyn
 
Posts: 1091
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 5:15 pm

Postby EmperorJeramyu » Tue Jan 23, 2007 6:33 pm

Sarcasm wrote:Well, it seems we have finally reached an agreement (In a civilized way no less, suprisingly enough).

That's because neither of our names are "Impossible" or "Excell".

Sarcasm wrote:And actually in the second part of my post, the one you quoted, I was refering to an analogy between the greatest tragedy (Oedipus) and The Way, In both cases, fully learning eveything on yourself shall not save you but instead destroy you given the fact this is not knowledge mere mortals were ment to know.

That works for the Reaches ending and the concept of truth itself, certainly. And although the limited truth he does learn about himself (or rather, the complete truth about Serena at the very least) in the normal ending (at its maximum potential, with all the variables in the right postion) is not exactly a pleasant thing, he has to press on and start a new life. It's sad, somewhat, but leaves infinite possibilities (an Eternal Horizon, if you will).

EDIT-- Speaking of the normal ending, I just noticed that if it proceeds that your Kloe variable is 6 or more, Serena's pendant can be seen flowing up the river. I'm sure it's symbolic for something. I guess it could mean The Way really is circular, not that we didn't already have enough evidence.

EDIT 2-- Something else. After the credits in the "The Beginning." map, if you get the normal ending and don't have Kloe, Rhue will be shown below. Rhue drops an "..." while looking at the sword. Now here's the interesting part, normally Rhue will walk away off screen. BUT IF YOU LOST TO THE PHANTOM SLASHER IN THE FINAL PLUNGE (or rather, he reduces your HP to zero at least once, since you can't actually lose), Rhue does NOT walk away. Amazing detail, eh? I wonder what the real, full consequences are...
"Unfortunately, the dragon only speaks in Napalm, a curious ancient language that you don't really need to speak to understand."
User avatar
EmperorJeramyu
Blana Sera
 
Posts: 2271
Joined: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:38 pm

Postby Teenr0cker » Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:38 pm

Sarcasm wrote:Oedipus


But...but...the difference is in The Way, Rhue doesn't end up a wandering, self-blinded, divorced hobo. And he didn't father his own siblings. Or even MEET his mother...



Unless Lun changed the ending between Beta and release a bit...Not that I'd be surprised.
Sage Of The Wise wrote:This sounds like the beginning of a sitcom. Think about it: "Coming this fall to Fox, Ralphie and the Hooker".
User avatar
Teenr0cker
S2 Deralyn
 
Posts: 3001
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 11:52 am

Postby Rangi42 » Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:06 pm

Wow, that was the first argument I've read here that ended in mutual agreement, instead of mindless insulting or the topic being locked. (Of course I'm new here and haven't browsed through nearly all the boards, so I may have missed a second civil conversation.)

EmperorJeramyu wrote:
Sarcasm wrote:Well, it seems we have finally reached an agreement (In a civilized way no less, suprisingly enough).


That's because neither of our names are "Impossible" or "Excell".


:lol:

Teenr0cker wrote:But...but...the difference is in The Way, Rhue doesn't end up a wandering, self-blinded, divorced hobo. And he didn't father his own siblings. Or even MEET his mother...


Every read Oedipus at Colonus? He's not just wandering, self-blinded, and divorced, he's also a spiteful, vindictive, petty, dead-by-the-end-of-the-play b*****d. His son begs him for forgiveness that he didn't speak up when Oedipus was exiled, and Oedipus just curses him.
...Or I could just be overreacting, because we've been reading the play aloud in class for weeks.

EmperorJeramyu wrote:EDIT 2-- Something else. After the credits in the "The Beginning." map, if you get the normal ending and don't have Kloe, Rhue will be shown below. Rhue drops an "..." while looking at the sword. Now here's the interesting part, normally Rhue will walk away off screen. BUT IF YOU LOST TO THE PHANTOM SLASHER IN THE FINAL PLUNGE (or rather, he reduces your HP to zero at least once, since you can't actually lose), Rhue does NOT walk away. Amazing detail, eh? I wonder what the real, full consequences are...


This note might give you an idea of what they are...

Code: Select all
Small Choice (002,009) CONTROLLER:
   [RHUE and LEXUS talk, etc.]
   Show Choice: Leave/Ask her a question
   [Leave] Case
      RHUE: I nearly loved you.
      [A flash of light.]
      Note: Last screen with Lexus.  Walk through trippy hallways toward light.
            Deal with Lexus at the end of she is there.  Make choice to take sword and this paves
            the way for the 3rd ending.
      Teleport: 0326:Strange, but true? (006,004)
I've used this name on boards for a while before I learned about the artist and Crestfallen Studios site designer Rangi.
Rhue: People aren't perfect!
Phantom: People are selfish.
Rhue: They can change...
Phantom: You know they can't.
Rhue: Some try!
Phantom: All fail.
Rhue: ... ...I don't care. I just want someone who won't stop trying. And I won't stop either...
User avatar
Rangi42
Plyn
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:59 pm

Postby PseudoFlare » Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:27 pm

Get this: The Way 4 is the ONLY (Apart from The Way 1, but that didn't even really count as The Way series, it's only a mere introduction; only 30 minutes long and when I replayed it, it felt really amateurish. Go figure) and ONLY series that doesn't have instant kill and no battles with cheat plunge on. Also there's a bug on The Way 4 at the end (I'm not sure if this is on purpose or a mistake) which is activated when you press ESC while Strata is about to take a plunge with you. You then will be able to walk around freely but if you go to the top right of the screen, you'll see Lexus (although she's supposed to be dead). Anybody see a connection to this? I'm totally confused by then on why Lun bothered to put Lexus there.
Image
User avatar
PseudoFlare
Plyn
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2006 10:05 pm
Location: A really short way, just left of your street 3 blocks ahead.

Postby Sarcasm » Wed Jan 24, 2007 11:18 am

I just thought of another parrel between the two stories, The Blana Sara could very well be the Orchestra (ugh, I am 90% sure this is the wrong term, someone who has studied Oedipus in English give me a hand) , notice their voice files are played in many different parts of the play, as if they sing the song of destiny in The Way.

They also seem to be semi-transcendent, a step above characters, but a step below the reader
1,000,000,672+1D4 Bludgeoning to the face, bitch!
User avatar
Sarcasm
S1 Corlyn
 
Posts: 1091
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 5:15 pm

Postby Rangi42 » Wed Jan 24, 2007 11:33 am

PseudoFlare wrote:Also there's a bug on The Way 4 at the end (I'm not sure if this is on purpose or a mistake) which is activated when you press ESC while Strata is about to take a plunge with you. You then will be able to walk around freely but if you go to the top right of the screen, you'll see Lexus (although she's supposed to be dead). Anybody see a connection to this? I'm totally confused by then on why Lun bothered to put Lexus there.


Probably that's a glitch from when she was still alive and watching you in the tournament; it should teleport straight to the EpisodeSaveScreen and Credits.

Sarcasm wrote:I just thought of another parrel between the two stories, The Blana Sara could very well be the Orchestra (ugh, I am 90% sure this is the wrong term, someone who has studied Oedipus in English give me a hand) , notice their voice files are played in many different parts of the play, as if they sing the song of destiny in The Way.


You mean the Chorus.

Version 1.1 of the guide is now available. What's been changed:
  • Added the Episode 6 rabbit racing minigame and the "Someone was here" event to the "Deleted and Altered Scenes" section.
  • Added Cetsa's not always appearing dead in the credits to the "Minor Easter Eggs" section.
  • Added some notes from a beta version of Episode 5, from the prison cell in Episode 5, from the battle with Core in Episode 6, and from the "Small Choice" map in Episode 6 to the "Notes" section.
  • Added miscellaneous comments to the "Bookshelves" section.
  • Added fade-out times to all "Fade-Out BGM" codes (e.g. "Fade-Out BGM: 3s.").
  • Reformatted all "Teleport:", "Call Save Menu", and "Goto Title Screen" codes.
  • Fixed various formatting errors (e.g. incorrect indents) and spelling/grammar errors.
EmperorJeramyu and Angel_OA, thanks for the contributions.
I've used this name on boards for a while before I learned about the artist and Crestfallen Studios site designer Rangi.
Rhue: People aren't perfect!
Phantom: People are selfish.
Rhue: They can change...
Phantom: You know they can't.
Rhue: Some try!
Phantom: All fail.
Rhue: ... ...I don't care. I just want someone who won't stop trying. And I won't stop either...
User avatar
Rangi42
Plyn
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:59 pm

Postby Sarcasm » Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:51 pm

Doh, Thank you, I cannot believe I forgot that word.
1,000,000,672+1D4 Bludgeoning to the face, bitch!
User avatar
Sarcasm
S1 Corlyn
 
Posts: 1091
Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 5:15 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Estrana

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

cron