Character break-down

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Postby nightshadow » Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:39 pm

DSOK wrote:Is that all he did? It seemed to me that it was (relatively) easy to get level one injuries, but that the higher-level injuries didn't appear where they should have when I did really collosal amounts of damage. So I wonder if the plunge rules weren't tweaked to prevent more powerful injuries.


Actually, it is possible to get step 1, 2, 3, and 4 injuries. I know with my above file completing ep.5 with backlash, going through ep. 3 again, then going through ep. 5 again. I did between 65-98 dmg with Backlash as my link.

It's proven...

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Postby fwacho » Tue Sep 28, 2004 1:27 pm

Lun did try to make sure that the plunge would be lost but give a chance of lasting a bit. This of course is a tough balance to strike. I leveled up along time and just barely got past it. the plunge in E5 is meant to be your chance to take strata down.
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Postby DSOK » Tue Sep 28, 2004 1:40 pm

fwacho wrote:Lun did try to make sure that the plunge would be lost but give a chance of lasting a bit. This of course is a tough balance to strike. I leveled up along time and just barely got past it. the plunge in E5 is meant to be your chance to take strata down.

I did think the difficulty was just about right; the vast majority of the times I played, I lasted in the range of 5-7 passes with a maximally beefed up character. It's just that, when you are that powerful, it's occasionally possible to get weird, slightly buggy effects such as we've described.
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Postby Kyle » Wed Sep 29, 2004 8:26 am

I'm glad I didn't beat Strata at the end of EP5. I felt Rhue wasn't ready for that kind of fight yet. Especially not in the situation he was in. He's supposed to rush after Gaius and he can only BARELY keep up with him without fighting Strata. Imagine how hard he'd have to run to gain in on Gaius after the plunge :roll: ^

Also, you have absolutely no chance against him earlier in the episode and all of a sudden you can beat him? And don't give me that "but he must be tired from running with Lyrra!", because they don't do anything but wander and can last many rounds in a plunge to the death. Rhue has been running a lot too and he's not tired either.

No offense to Lun, but that's one of the things I loved and hated at the same thing. Loved it because it was a very intense and cool fight, hated it because it's one of the more illogical things in the entire series. Of course, I could just be missing some of the reasons behind it that Lun thought of but I failed to pick up.
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Postby Amgard » Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:33 pm

Howabout getting four very powerful Auras from Slade after gouging the shit out of his ribcage?

Yeah, not to mention those hundred blood lyn he killed.

Plus Strata, yes, had been running from Lyrra for awhile, in addition to having just finished a plunge with Cetsa and being emotionally screwed up since his girl was dead.
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Postby DSOK » Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:42 pm

Amgard wrote:Howabout getting four very powerful Auras from Slade after gouging the shit out of his ribcage?

Yeah, not to mention those hundred blood lyn he killed.

Plus Strata, yes, had been running from Lyrra for awhile, in addition to having just finished a plunge with Cetsa and being emotionally screwed up since his girl was dead.

There are definite reasons why Rhue should have a much better chance against Strata the second time around. However, I thought he was too easy at the end, frankly. Strata's loss of efficacy seemed a bit too great. At the beginning of the episode his stats would make him just barely beatable if you had a maximally pumped up character, but at the end, he's not that hard. I suppose Lun wanted to make it possible to beat him even without a top-notch Rhue, but I think the result was that Strata became too easy.
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Postby Amgard » Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:46 pm

Well if you're not at max, your only shot is a Injury 4 using Ray of Light (Which is what I did). Otherwise, fighting is an uphill battle, as he does more damage than you.
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Postby DSOK » Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:51 pm

Amgard wrote:Well if you're not at max, your only shot is a Injury 4 using Ray of Light (Which is what I did). Otherwise, fighting is an uphill battle, as he does more damage than you.

How bad were your plunge stats? My super Rhue wiped the floor with him, so I would imagine that even if you missed a couple lyn rocks, you'd still have a good chance.
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Postby Amgard » Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:53 pm

I'm guessing between 14-16, but I'm not totally sure (I know I hit 14 before the Slade plunge, though)
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Postby Sage Of The Wise » Wed Sep 29, 2004 5:17 pm

The problem is how your attack is calulated. When you do a random number between 1 and 6 about 18 times the damage difference becomes to great and either person can have either a very weak attack or a super powerful attack at any given moment.
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Postby DSOK » Wed Sep 29, 2004 5:51 pm

Sage Of The Wise wrote:The problem is how your attack is calulated. When you do a random number between 1 and 6 about 18 times the damage difference becomes to great and either person can have either a very weak attack or a super powerful attack at any given moment.

I was just thinking about something similar. The damage you do increases multiplicatively with your stats, but the damage required to get a level 4 injury stays at your damage threshold plus 20. Since the damage you're doing is the more rapidly increasing of the two, it gets easier and easier to do wipe your enemy out with a single blow. In fact, that's how I won almost all plunges later in the game. I would just do repeated risk attacks, until I got a really high damage total.

I went back to try the plunge with Strata again, and I found that he could beat me (with a level 4 injury) if he got especially lucky. On the other, hand, if I won a risk attack on the first round, the damage breakdown was about 15 to me and 80 to him. So I guess it's really the high potential for a level 4 injury that made Strata (and pretty much everybody else I plunged) relatively easy.
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Postby Sage Of The Wise » Wed Sep 29, 2004 5:53 pm

I have terible luck with risk attacks, I always just saved up for a finisher, if i could get to it, id always win.
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Postby DSOK » Wed Sep 29, 2004 6:20 pm

Sage Of The Wise wrote:I have terible luck with risk attacks, I always just saved up for a finisher, if i could get to it, id always win.

I found that, over the course of 62 plunge passes, my opponent chose the attack immediately after the one he did just previously 32 times. I can't swear that this wasn't a big statistical anomaly, but I did actually count techniques they used and got a strongly biased result. I've since made use this fact in all my plunges and done pretty well (well enough, for example, that in no battle since episode 1 has anyone come even close to getting off a finisher).
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Postby Amgard » Sun Oct 10, 2004 10:46 pm

I just work off impulse. Makes the fight more interesting.
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Postby Berserker » Mon Oct 11, 2004 6:11 am

The problem is how your attack is calulated. When you do a random number between 1 and 6 about 18 times the damage difference becomes to great and either person can have either a very weak attack or a super powerful attack at any given moment.


Maybe it was a bug, but once Strata did 250+ damage using Backlash, while sometimes I don't even suffer an injury, so...
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