Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sage Of The Wise » Fri Feb 20, 2009 1:34 pm

1. The Phantom Slasher
- is Rhue's sword.
- is the misterious shadow killer we see throughout the episodes
- is not equivalent to any other character
- absorbs the aura of whom it killed, or when near death/destruction
- is nullifyed (is there a better word?) by Traziun in one ending
- to me, it seems that it has its own personality, which seems sort of cynic/antisocial

Sounds good so far.

2. The Endings
I have found 3. In one Traziun destroys PS, in two Rhue stays in DE, in three they fall into the Reaches.
Are there any more? And also one thing I don't quite get; but I will get to that later.

Yeah, theres only three.

3. Dream Estrana
It seems to me that everything killed by/near the PS has its aura absorbed so we find Estrana, Midian, Lyrra, Slade, etc. who are obviously dead, inside the sword. It also means that Sacrifa died while bringing destruction to the city, am I correct? And Alan is dead also. Janwen was destroyed and appears below DE. So that's why if I play the reaches ending Rhue doesn't actually die, as he is in reality an illusion-world. The girls seem to die, but do not really, because they're already dead, I think that is just a symbol of denial from Rhue.
The thing I don't understand is why Gaius and Traziun appear in the Reaches ending (if I remeber correctly). Neither should be that, unless Rhue falling into the Reaches unleashes some sort of greater evil etc... any explanation for this?

Sacrifa is killed in the Crystal Forest(think that's what it was called) in EP5. Sacrifa and some random guided set up camp there and were going to meat up with the Guided Rebellion. The PS popped up and killed Sacrifa mere seconds after his 'there is no PS' speech. Alan's legs are sticking out of a bush in this scene, most likely meaning Sacrifa and Co. killed him and shoved him in the bush. Either way thats how the PS got both of their auras.
I think Rhue does die in the reaches ending, judging by the bloodstain left in the real world where he last was. The whole ending with the girls and Slade, Traziun, and Gaius was like some really metaphorical purgatory place or somthing, no idea really.

4. The Tower
It also seems symbolic to me that Cetsa is held in real Estrana in the Tower, and in Rhue's eyes she seemed to hold the Truth, and in DE Truth is also equivalent to the top room of the tower. I think I also understand why PS tells that it has no power to withold others from that place, as IMHO each aura has its imprint on the world inside PS, this is probably why Lyrra is living in a faraway flowery kingdom, right?
But I think something escapes me about that significance. Jeruh is dead, his aura also has an impression on PS so why stay in that small room? I don't think the PS would have the power to hold him there. I just don't understand...
It is also funny that even though everyone feels something is amiss, Lyrra and the others don't realize they are dead...

Well, I really don't have an explanation for that one. My best guess is that the sword did all it could to keep Rhue from running into the aura of Jeruh. When they do get into the cell Jeruh is in he doesn't seem to know he's even been in a cell the entire time, its more like he was in a catatonic state until they opened the door. Cause right after they come in hes just like, 'i gotta go, i need to find serena.' so nonchalantly. I'd also argue that Lyrra's fantasy world wasn't created by her aura's imprint on the world, but that the sword made for her so Rhue wouldn't find her and use her to open the cell. As for why she can open it I have no idea. Maybe she has a similar aura to Jeruh, being siblings and all that lets her through. But then Jed would probably have worked as well and he's easy enough to find. Could also have to do with her having previously wielded a shadow sword, only other special thing about her I can think of.


5. Kava and Kura/The Mimic
Eh, I understand the Kava/Kura theory but I think it's insignificant. My other important question is, where does the figure of the Mimic come from? I haven't encountered any mention of it in the game (or I don't remember), maybe I left out something important? Or is this an official theory/Legend?

In the room beyond the tomb in EP6 where you get Lexus, there are three poems. One is about Venge, ones about Kura, and ones about the Mimic. It would be poetic in itself if all three were the same person, Rhue.

6. Serena, the unseen family.
We see mother and three children: I think it's obvious that they are Slade, Chasta and Serena.
a., Anyone any idea to the identity of the mother?
b., She tells: "The little one is dead". She turns it to be some sort of punishment, as in reality she was killed as an innocent victim of fate/coincidence/Jeruh being at the wrong place and picking up the wrong sword. Is she trying to turn this into a moral issue or maybe that misterious woman has something to do with the events turning this way.
c., How in the Reaches does Dirk know Scatha?
d., Who is the father?:)

Well, all the kids went out to their secret spot to play at night even though they weren't supposed to. So, Serena disobey's her mom and she dies because of it, I don't think there's much more beyond that. Mom probably didn't have anything to do with it besides being an overbearing bitch. No idea how Dirk knew Scatha, other than it was from back when she was Scatha. Theory is that he's the guy Scatha/Chasta slept with that caused her banishment to begin with.

7. To unlock the Reaches ending, you need to defeat 4 shadowy figures... who are they? I don't think I get that part...
After each victory there is a quote something like one more shadow burns in the flames or something similar...

No idea who the shadowy figures are other than silhouettes of Strata, Scatha, Cetsa, and a Headhunter. Maybe Rhue's sword was able to absorb a small part of all their aura's just from being around them for a long time in general in some cases, or near death but not actually dead in others. The 'new dark flame is burning in the depths' thing just means that one of the flames in the four rooms surrounding the entrance to the reaches has been lit. When they are all lit you can open the door.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Cavalier » Sat Feb 21, 2009 8:46 am

Sage Of The Wise wrote:Well, I really don't have an explanation for that one. My best guess is that the sword did all it could to keep Rhue from running into the aura of Jeruh. When they do get into the cell Jeruh is in he doesn't seem to know he's even been in a cell the entire time, its more like he was in a catatonic state until they opened the door. Cause right after they come in hes just like, 'i gotta go, i need to find serena.' so nonchalantly. I'd also argue that Lyrra's fantasy world wasn't created by her aura's imprint on the world, but that the sword made for her so Rhue wouldn't find her and use her to open the cell. As for why she can open it I have no idea. Maybe she has a similar aura to Jeruh, being siblings and all that lets her through. But then Jed would probably have worked as well and he's easy enough to find. Could also have to do with her having previously wielded a shadow sword, only other special thing about her I can think of.


I always assumed that the cell was the place where the dominant aura was kept. That would also explain why Midian was trying to get there himself, (though finding Jeruh was also probably a motive), his aura was kept there before Jeruh. I've always wondered if the aura in the tower is always catonic, or if it was because Rhue himself was catonic at the time.

I think that perhaps every shadow sword has its own little world inside, shaped over the years somehow. When Lyra was killed, her own "Shadow World" was absorbed into Rhue's, and became an alternate dimension inside. She naturally became the ruler of the world, because she created it.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sling » Sat Feb 21, 2009 12:28 pm

Yeah, I thought that the cell was where the dominant aura was kept too.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby blackandsilver » Sat Feb 21, 2009 4:04 pm

Hm, thx for the answers
I still don't really get everything, but I suppose that's the way Lun intended it, hm? :)
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby blackandsilver » Sat Feb 21, 2009 4:12 pm

Actually I don't agree with Dirk being the lover in Scatha's past, for one he is much older (seems so) and two they do not seem on unfriendly terms. I'd guess Scatha hates the reason of the loss of her pretty face...
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sling » Sat Feb 21, 2009 5:29 pm

Dirk is one theory, although it is far more likely that Scatha slept with Strata. Afterall, Slade said he knew Strata when they met in Episode 1 and Scatha's stereotyping of men is very similar to what Strata is like.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sage Of The Wise » Sat Feb 21, 2009 6:30 pm

Well, the problem with just saying the dominant aura is in that cell is that first, there was no cell to keep it in until EP5 when Estrana exploded, and second, its not like there's a single aura controlling Rhue at any given time, I've always thought Rhue's aura by the point the game takes place as hundreds of pieces of different auras patched on to his original aura as the sword sees fit to keep him doing... whatever. At this point his original aura is non existent, but its not 100% Jeruh, since not all his memories are the same as Jeruh's, most notably the place Rhue remembers as Landorin isn't actually Landorin. Smaller example is how Rhue remembers giving the pendant to Serena and then going to watch the starts with her, while Lyrra claims Jeruh had given the pendant do Serena and then she went off to look at the stars with someone else. (Possibly Midian, but if not then someone killed in the Landorin Massacre so he'd have that aura by the time its mentioned in either case)
Anyway, I'm just trying to say I don't think Jeruh was in the cell cause he has to be as the 'dominant aura', but because the sword put him there so he couldn't cause trouble.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sling » Sat Feb 21, 2009 7:43 pm

Well, what makes you think Dream Estrana was "absorbed" from real Estrana? It makes sense with Estrana exploding and all, but I didn't think that non-living things had auras... or souls for that matter. Bearing in mind that Dream Estrana is an artificial construct of Rhue's Shadow Sword or some such, maybe the Shadow Sword "chose" what the dream world looked like. Even if Dream Estrana was absorbed somehow, that doesn't mean that there were previous dream world's locked up in the sword that Rhue could have ended up in had the shadow sword not absorbed Estrana that had some place similar to the cell at the top of the Arm of Estrana.

However, the theory that Jeruh being in the cell indicates his aura's dominance and the theory that he is there to keep Rhue from bumping into him aren't mutually exclusive. He could be there for both reasons. Regarding the nature of Rhue's aura, I thought that after the Landorin massacre Jeruh changed his name to Rhue and pretended that the massacre never happened and tried to phase the memories out of his mind. I always thought that "Rhue" was simply an indentity Jeruh made up for himself. That would explain Rhue's false memories, afterall, I'm pretty sure that in the tower cell Jeruh tells Rhgue that those memories were "lies he [Jeruh] had made up" and that Rhue was an alias Jeruh cooked up as well. Also, dominant aura does not mean the only aura. His aura is a mish-mash of different peoples, but Jeruh's aura is the most dominant over the lot. Hmm, I need to replay EP6 I think.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sage Of The Wise » Sat Feb 21, 2009 8:27 pm

Mmm, good points. Jeruh does say that stuff, but we don't really get a look into his mind long enough to know if the Rhue we know is an exact copy of Jeruh's Rhue pesona. I always liked the idea that the sword combined the Jeruh memories with memories of others (again, Midian or whoever from Landorin that applied) who had happier memories of Serena just to further cement the idea that Serena is the perfect girl in Rhue's mind.

I don't think Jeruh would have already made up these memories as part of his Rhue persona because he hadn't needed he was already head over heels for for her without fake memories. Unless Jeruh was a mentally unstable kid to begin with and was always just making up stuff so he could stay in his fantasy world. It does seem to run in the family afterall.

So really, I got nothing >_>
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sling » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:22 am

Maybe it is a combination of both Jeruh's fantasy bubble AND multiplie auras mish-mashing together vying for control? Afterall, when a shadow sword has accumulated enough auras, the wielder gets schizophrenia and goes insane. In fact, yes, the mish-mashing of different auras is quite plausible, of course, one is aura has a more significant place though. Didn't the red-haired woman (Traz's mum) in EP 6 say that all the different auras struggle for dominance inside the sword or whatever? Hmm...
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Cavalier » Tue Feb 24, 2009 2:40 pm

Which reminds me of another point. Traziun's mom mentioned that she had heard of someone who had learned to avoid going mad and exploding with auras. Is there any indication on whether she is talking about Kalmar, (he had a shadow sword, and seemed sane enough) or Rhue (Also sane, at least for a given definition of sane)?
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sage Of The Wise » Tue Feb 24, 2009 5:22 pm

I don't think it was Rhue, I'd have to read the conversation again but it definitely seemed to me like she was referring to Kalmar if its any one we know. I'd hardly call Rhue sane by any means. To say that even his current persona of Rhue is sane is kinda a stretch, but regardless, but the very fact he takes on different personalities on his swords will pretty much excludes him from being sane. Kalmar seems like a good choice since she would know him, and probably better than most, he has a shadow sword, its implied hes really old but he at least seems in complete control of his actions. And having it be someone we don't know is kinda a bust.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sling » Wed Feb 25, 2009 7:23 am

Given that Kalmar is Traz's dad, it isn't too much to imagine she is referring to Kalmar.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby the fondler » Tue Aug 25, 2009 4:50 pm

Hope you guys don't mind if I add in my two cents to this topic as well. I also have some crazy idea who The Girl may be, my reasons to believe coming from when Rhue, Sacrifa, and Midian are all at The House of Pnoe asking The Girl about the portal stone and this particular part of dialogue stood out to me.

RHUE: Flaming fires of Janwen...

SACRIFA: Do you have to say that
in front of the lady...?

THE GIRL: Why not?... Is that bad?

SACRIFA:Well...

THE GIRL: Just wondering, 'cause I hear it all
the time in here... Still don't
know what it means though.

Perhaps I'm reading into it too much, but I find it very strange The Girl doesn't know what Rhue is referring to when he curses. It seems burning Janwen is the most common curse words for people after it's destruction so isn't it a little weird she doesn't seem to understand? Which leads me to believe The Girl is someone Pre-Janwen and was absorbed by Rhue Pre-Janwen as well. And then that's pretty much where my theory ends. Unfortunately I don't have any other leads helping me identifying her identity.

Then again her parents could've just raised her so well she never curses, she seems nice enough.
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Re: Truth, beliefs, and theories of The Way [TheoryExtravaganza]

Postby Sage Of The Wise » Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:42 am

That could also be used as evidence that shes Serena, because since she died as a kid she never learned words like that. For her to be Pre Janwen would meen Rhue was around absorbing stuff before Janwen, which while certainly possible since we know so little of his origins, does go against pretty much every theory of his origin.
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